clubstylus

lambostylus wrote:Thanks a lot, I'l give it a go... I was just wary of a number of things I've seen on the sight here, regarding everything from rocker arms, rear suspension links and incorrect springs on the shocks. Not good for comforting thoughts!

Mark G

stylussprinter wrote:Most comment on here regarding suspension is by way of advice . I'm not sure anyone has actually had incorrect springs delivered in the kit

Antnicuk wrote:I need to set up my suspension and found this thread, My camber on the front is looks at quite an angle. I have a feeling the suspension is going to need a lot of tweaking but i want to start by getting the front geometry correct.

I have read the above but not quite sure what it means or how to do it. Could anyone give me a simple how to guide? i also need reminding which way is positive and which is negative?,

NEGATIVE = wheels leaning into the body at the top (what you need )
POSITIVE = wheels leaning away from the body at the top(vintage only )

I assume i have to set the height i want first? Is there a reccomended height? and where is it measured from?

THIS ONE ISN'T EASY --- because I've not seen your car so have no idea what length shocks(open-closed) and springs you have(length & lbs)
The ride height will be effectively limited by all the above UNLESS your budget can afford to change them. Assuming you can't do that then --- RIDE height(measured under the front lower 50 x 25mm chassis tube) needs to be 25mm ''lower'' than the RIDE height at the rear(measured under the join of alloy floor to steel seat pan -drivers side)
Shock adjusting platforms should be set so that there is PISTON travel (the shiny 12mm rod showing through the spring coils) of 25mm at the FRONT.
When you set the rear shocks to acheive the 25mm higher ride height --- check what piston travel is visible (hopefully it will be more than the front)
THESE adjustments will give you the ride height BUT is a guide only because spring lbs will control how much of the piston travel you WILL need
ALL THESE adjustments assume weight being on the cars wheels

I want a setting that will be ok for a little bit of road use and track days.

TRACK & ROAD -- it would be a good starting point to set TOE at straight ahead OR only just IN (wheels pointing towards each other) The track rods on the ends of the steering rack WILL adjust that.CAMBER -- set it to 1.5 NEGATIVE until you've got experience under your belt --- i.e. when you corner very fast you will get more roll therefore you'll need more negative camber so that the tyre is sitting flat through the corners onto the tarmac ---- there are ways to limit roll but that's another discussion when you've got started and WANT MORE
TYRE PRESSURES --- depends how heavy you are but MAX 20 psi all round ----- I run 17psi (tyre makes vary on result 2 to 3 psi)

I'm also not sure what shocks and springs the car has in it. The shocks are red and i think they are AVO, are these standard fitment?, if so, should i keep them? my springs on the back are blue if this means anything, when i took it round the block i had set all four shocks to max firmness and it rattled my teeth. I have now set to soft and will try again.

SHOCK CLICKS ---- count how many clicks there are on your shocks from low to high --- set the FRONT at 1/3 rd of the total & the REAR at 2/3 rds

CASTOR --- you will have very little control over this on a standard kit so I'd leave it alone at first build setting ---- it can be altered by design £££££ BUT also a little with standard wishbones using great care. A later discussion perhaps as there's so much that will effect your handling .
FINALLY --- with all that grunt you intend having -- FIT one of my FRONT ARB kits ----- this will reduce roll plus rear wheel lift in cornering -- therefore MORE GRIP
I've been over this subject many times and the above is a guide because it's not my car or driving style nor can I see the result --- driving it on track will allow you to better understand what the car is doing under very hard cornering which will lead you to change these settings .
DOES IT UNDERSTEER , OVERSTEER etc . I think I've covered everything

Any recomendations welcomed.

Stylussprinter wrote:RIDE height(measured under the front lower 50 x 25mm chassis tube) needs to be 25mm higher than the RIDE height at the rear

Werner Van Loock wrote:

Stylussprinter wrote:RIDE height(measured under the front lower 50 x 25mm chassis tube) needs to be 25mm higher than the RIDE height at the rear

Don't you mean front 25mm lower then rear?

Antnicuk wrote:You are a star, thanks for that, very usefull.

The car does come with an anti roll bar, i'm not sure if its one of yours though and its not fitted. How thick is yours and is it hollow or solid. Mine is 14-15mm thick with a 5mm wall but hollow

MY ARB kit fits within the front engine bay , just in front of the engine and attaches to the rocker arms. Bars are 13 or 16mm solid and 400mm long plus have my logo on them ROB M SPORT
Yours , I'm guessing , will bolt on the front chassis rail and connect to each bottom wishbone , if they brackets welded on to take it

Is there any way i can set this up at home?, or do i have to take it to an alignment centre?

I've explained how to adjust everything in the previous post Perhaps you mean the camber ? Undo the bottom joint to give more negative camber . Put a spirit level touching the bottom outside of the tyre and measure between the top of the tyre wall to the spirit level when the spirit level is exactly vertical. One centimetre will be approximately 1.5 degrees negative plus ----- good enough to start off . This isn't accurate but it's good enough to get left and right equal

One last question, from what i can gather the shocks are softer if i turn them anti clock, there are about 18 clicks. Am i turning 1/3rd from soft or 1/3rd from hard?

You obviously start from the lowest setting = SOFT = fully anticlockwise .

I'll check the height tomorrow, I have a couple of days off to prep it for the MOT on saturday hopefull it will pass!

Then i have an activity day at North Weald airfield which i can use as a bit of a shake down as i live very close and there is nothing to hit if the wheel comes off................. literally! although it wont be mapped so i will be running low boost and not low rpm's.

Antnicuk wrote:I actually put a spirit level on the wheels this afternoon before i checked your reply, They are both the same and there is about 1 cm gap with the level verticle so I am am going to give it a go.

One problem I do have is that i only have about 1.5 inches of travel left in my front shocks and the car needs to go lower. Paul (previous owner) had some extra bottom mounting points welded inboard of the original mounts in order to lower the car more but had to revert back as the crank pulley wouldnt go between the shocks when he changed the engine. I seem to remember paul said he had to use different springs though.



I now have room to move the shocks closer to the centre again which would lower the car. Is this a common modification and is it worth moving the shocks? Would i need different springs?, if so, do they need to be harder or softer?

How can i tell if the springs are too hard or soft?

I have plenty of travel at the back with it at the height i want but its 15mm lower than the front from the measuring points you mention.

Do you have a picture of your arb in place so i could see if i still have room as i have an intercooler in the way

Antnicuk wrote:I have moved the shocks to the centre mounts and although the car is lower it is still only the same height as the back. (the back is where i want it) the measurements under the points mentioned above is 11.5 cm. I can lower it anymore as i have no more shock travel on the fron shocks.

1) The rear should then be 140mm but 133mm at the very least OR you'll get understeer big time

Whats the option to get it lower?, do i need to get a a new set of front shocks?, if so, what size?

2) To lower further , put them in the original mounting points THEN buy 11 inch shocks fitted with 7 inch springs ---- can't say what lbs springs . Depends on the car weight , your weight and the weight distribution . i.e. front to rear 50% ---- 50% for example . I assume your engine is lighter than most
You're unlikely to get the perfect set up at first stab anyway even with the benefit of my info ------ I didn't . What ' time ' has shown me is what to do to alter what is happening and by how much . Driving hard on track is the only test of the direction you take ---- assess the result (write down all settings) ----- make your changes(writing them down too) ---------------- and onwards This way you will know whether a spring change up 20 or 50 lbs (or a shock setting or wedge change) goes towards your goal ------ if it does , continue in that direction till it causes a disadvantage

Sprinter, can you give me the measurement on your arb set up between the over shock mount and the end of the arb where the links attach to?, i just need to make sure that it will miss the front of my engine.

3) Not sure what measurement you refer to However the lever arms welded to the ends of the ' bar ' extend at 90 degrees for 95mm . I'll measure from the back of the ' bar ' towards the front chassis rail then edit this post for you . That will give you a total distance (including ' bar ' diameter) from chassis rail to ends of lever arms.

ANSWER is = 190mm from the radiator side of the lower 50 x 25 mm chassis rail towards the engine / lever arms ends. This is approx'ly 20mm from a line drawn across the chassis from the inboard end shock mounts ---- the lever arms are fitted with their ends pointing skywards about 50mm off the chassis triangular rails. This gives room for suspension travel .

Also how much are they for the thicker one?